Game Under Podcast 146 - GTA Richmond

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00:00:21 Intro

00:01:17 News

00:24:51 Baldur's Gate 3 Review

00:53:29 Paper Mario: The Origami King

00:58:45 Trademark Banter - The Original Tom's Insurance Scam (Perfectly Legal)

00:01:24 Phil asks Tom Other People's Listener's Questions

Transcript:
Tom: Hello and welcome to episode of The Game Under Podcast.

Tom: Keen listeners who have a memory that stretches back a very long time will no doubt recall that I am Tom Towers, and that I am always joined by my co-host, Phil Fogg.

Phil: Hi everyone, I'm Phil Fogg.

Phil: I don't know what he's talking about.

Phil: We've been here every week for Australia's longest running podcast.

Tom: These days, just to interrupt you, these days I think a week is a very long time.

Phil: That is true.

Tom: It feels almost like many, many months, almost like a year and a half.

Phil: But on all the subscription services, it says that we've already done episodes, but this is episode

Tom: Are we skipping some special episodes we've done?

Phil: I think so.

Phil: We only put the real number on the real show, of which this is, so I guess we better do one.

Phil: We'll start with some news.

Phil: I don't know if you're up with the talk of the town, but this Pokemon game with guns is getting quite a lot of buzz.

Phil: It had more concurrent Steam players than Cyberpunk or Elden Ring.

Tom: Is this also an augmented reality game?

Phil: I don't believe so, no.

Tom: So we don't have children running around with guns shooting invisible Pokemon.

Phil: That would be fantastic.

Phil: No, no.

Phil: So the name of the game is Palworld.

Phil: So it's basically a Pokemon, not a Pokemon Go.

Tom: So it's not an official Pokemon game either?

Phil: No, it's not.

Phil: And it's been in early access.

Phil: It just got released a couple of days ago, and I think they've sold million copies.

Phil: But I was looking at the artwork and video today, and it looks just like a Pokemon game.

Phil: Apparently, it's heavily skewed with a lot of off-color humor involving animal cruelty, which some people are concerned about.

Tom: I mean, Pokemon has that too, does it not?

Phil: Well, I think that's the commentary.

Tom: So, it's satirizing Pokemon.

Phil: Yeah, yeah.

Phil: Well, I think they've said it's a homage to Pokemon, which, I don't know, helps or hurts them in terms of getting sued by Nintendo.

Phil: But who would you think would be behind this as a developer?

Tom: Apparently, Pocket Pear is.

Phil: Pocket Pear?

Phil: Do you know what Pocket Pear is?

Tom: I think I'm going to assume a pair of trousers?

Phil: No, no, it's a pair of Japanese men in Tokyo.

Phil: Which makes it okay somehow in my head, because I was thinking, oh, this is some sort of Tencent China, you know, exploitation or, you know, some...

Tom: Because it's Japanese, your issue is that if it was China doing it, it would be cultural appropriation, I assume.

Phil: Exactly.

Phil: But because it's Japanese...

Tom: But of course, we know that basically all Japanese culture is culturally appropriated from China.

Tom: I think we can give them a bit of leeway.

Phil: Well, we don't have a lot of Japanese listeners, so I think we can say that, but...

Phil: And the other fact is that it's a small team.

Phil: It's just two dudes.

Phil: So that, I think, for them to do...

Phil: Well, obviously, it's going to be more than two dudes, but they haven't done any other games.

Tom: It's two dudes taking all the credit.

Phil: Yeah, two dudes taking all the credit, which is how is that different from anything else in history?

Tom: Exactly.

Phil: Like Buzz Lightyear and Neil Armstrong, you know, or the other guy.

Tom: They stole the credit from Woody completely.

Phil: Have you seen this game at all?

Phil: Do you have any interest in it?

Tom: This is the first time I've ever heard of it.

Phil: Okay, Pal World.

Phil: Yeah.

Tom: But I am, I have to admit, marginally intrigued.

Tom: Yeah, yeah.

Phil: I think the sense of humour is what carries it a fair bit, and also the guns, because, as I've often pointed out, if you introduce guns to any, to most genres, it improves them.

Tom: Luckily, most genres already have guns in them.

Phil: Yep.

Phil: In particular, games made by Machine Games, the makers of Wolfenstein, the new Wolfenstein games.

Phil: The first one was fantastic.

Phil: I thought the second one, did you play the second one?

Tom: I did not.

Tom: I think I borrowed it from you, and I played the first level, but that was as far as I got.

Phil: Fantastic action, fantastic shooting.

Phil: And the second one was a lot too talky.

Phil: There's just way too much walking and interaction with NPCs, for my liking.

Phil: And then they made New Blood, which I think was based on, well, I know was based on BJ Blazkowicz, the antagonist of the Wolfenstein series Daughters.

Tom: Isn't he the protagonist, not the antagonist?

Phil: Well, depends on if you're a Hitler or not, I guess.

Phil: Yeah, okay, so from your frame, from your lens, yeah, he's the protagonist.

Tom: From the allied worlds, he's the protagonist, but from the axis perspective, he's the antagonist.

Tom: So we know where your loyalty lies now.

Phil: Yeah, so anyway, those dudes, right, they're making the Indiana Jones game, which Microsoft is publishing and is going to release on their subscription service.

Phil: News number one, it's coming out in which is good news for people who want to watch an Indiana Jones movie made by MachineGames.

Phil: And other notable things is it's first person, and this is the other talk of the town today, is the controversy.

Phil: Well, this is an Indiana Jones game, and Indiana Jones was a basis for Tomb Raider and Uncharted, so it should be a third person action game.

Phil: But it's actually a first person game, so thoughts?

Tom: Not sure what the logic there is, why it would have to be third person, just because there were previously third person games that were inspired by the films.

Tom: I don't think that really tracks logically.

Phil: No, it doesn't.

Phil: Unless you have a very small brain and can only get your head around, well, I thought this was going to be like Uncharted.

Phil: But if it's going to be like Uncharted, what's the point?

Tom: Exactly.

Tom: And I think, well, the point would be to make an Uncharted that might be good, would be point number one.

Tom: Point number two, I think, is to take it in a different direction rather than thinking of it as them doing an Indiana Jones game, and therefore it should be third person.

Tom: Another way to look at it is, this is the Machine Games, the Nazi developer, and they're making another Nazi game, so it should be in first person perspective.

Phil: Yeah, and I don't know if you know that Machine Games was formed by the founders of Starbreeze.

Phil: Yeah, Starbreeze made The Darkness and also with Vin Diesel, Chronicles of Riddick.

Phil: And Chronicles of Riddick was originally an Xbox exclusive first person action game, which was critically, and I don't know how commercially successful it was, but it was critically well received, and particularly at the time also for being a very good licensed game.

Phil: So when you now know that the guys whose first game was Chronicles of Riddick, which was a licensed first person action game, are now making as Machine Games an Indiana Jones thing, I think that this could be fantastic.

Phil: It could also be very bad because Troy Baker is playing indie.

Tom: Was Troy Baker also Nathan Drake, or was that one of the other two big voice actors?

Phil: Troy Baker was the dude in pretty much everything, but he was in The Last of Us.

Phil: He was the brother in The Last Uncharted game.

Tom: So he had at least one role in Uncharted.

Phil: Yes, yeah.

Phil: But yeah, I'm looking forward to it, mostly on the basis of I was impressed with Machine Gun's first game, the first Wolfenstein, and I was thoroughly impressed with their very first game at Starbreeze as Chronicles of Riddick.

Phil: And Indiana Jones, I've been recently watching all of those movies again.

Phil: Have you watched all of the Indiana Jones movies?

Tom: I've watched the first one, which I enjoyed a lot.

Tom: I think I've seen at least two-thirds of the second one.

Phil: Yeah, not as good in most people's consideration.

Tom: I would also agree with that, and that's about it.

Phil: Yeah, the third one was fantastic.

Phil: That's the one with River Phoenix's young Indy and Sean Connery as Harrison Ford's dad or Indiana Jones's dad.

Phil: And that's The Last Crusade.

Phil: That to me is the best one.

Phil: And then they had the other one, which I watched the other day with Shia LaBeouf, which was okay, but poor.

Phil: And then I watched the last one, The Dial of Destiny, that came out this year, well, in and it was not good.

Phil: But anyway, as things go, perhaps something you'd be more interested in is Stalker

Phil: Have you been following its development?

Tom: Well, the last thing I would add on Indiana Jones is I think the thing that will be the best fit about machine games for an Indiana Jones game is I think their sense of humor is very similar to the sense of humor in the films.

Phil: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd say so.

Phil: And Indy is an interesting character.

Phil: I mean, he's a guy that doesn't have a lot of confidence or ability, and I think that's what makes him sort of that everyman type hero, which is what Uncharted was aspiring to as well.

Tom: I think Indiana Jones, like Han Solo, is Harrison Ford.

Tom: I think if you removed Harrison Ford from that role, I don't think there would be much to the character personally.

Phil: Here's some truth.

Phil: Do you know who they originally cast for the role?

Phil: But then he couldn't do it because he had to play Magnum PI?

Phil: Tom Selleck.

Tom: I don't think that would have worked as well.

Tom: So that was, that was, that was fortuitous.

Tom: Twist of fate.

Phil: Yeah, absolutely.

Phil: So Stalker what's your relationship with the franchise?

Tom: Well, the original Stalker is one of my favorite games of all time.

Tom: And I think you can make a very good argument for it being the best first person shooter ever made, depending on how you want to define that.

Tom: Of course, there is some stiff competition there if you're more interested in faster and more pure mechanics, such as Doom, among others.

Tom: But there's also a good argument to make.

Tom: It's the greatest open world game as well.

Tom: You could also make an argument it's the best Western RPG.

Tom: In addition to that, it's a game that just has an amazing breadth, complexity and depth to its gameplay, from the mechanics of the gunplay to the way the AI works in the world and the way you interact with it.

Tom: And narratively, it is just as engrossing as the gameplay is.

Phil: Have the guys that made Stalker done anything since Stalker?

Phil: I mean, there was DLC and other chapters added, I think.

Tom: They made two more Stalker games.

Tom: And I think that might actually have been it.

Phil: And, you know, forgive me, but is this the game where when you're above the surface, you've got a limited amount of air that you can use, or you're exposed to radiation?

Phil: That's that game, right?

Tom: That is Metro that you're thinking of there.

Tom: And that is heavily inspired by Stalker.

Phil: Righto, righto.

Phil: And the guys that developed this, where are they from?

Tom: The Ukraine, I believe.

Phil: Okay, that's right.

Phil: And that's why the development's probably been a little bit delayed and troubled, one would imagine.

Tom: That's right, except that may also just be their excuse, given that the original Stalker was meant to come out many, many years before it actually did.

Tom: And there was nothing like a war going on in Ukraine at that time either.

Phil: No, or COVID for that matter.

Phil: I mean, they're starting to stack up the years of excuses.

Tom: Exactly.

Phil: But they say now that it will, it was supposed to come out like in the next three months, but now it will be coming out in September which is the news.

Tom: So we might be seeing it within the next two to five years, we might guess.

Phil: Yeah, unless Russia wins the war, in which case...

Tom: Maybe they'll fast track it.

Tom: Maybe they'll apply some reasonable standards to what is expected of Ukrainian companies.

Phil: All right, anything else on Stalker before we move on to the last news story?

Tom: Just a correction.

Tom: Apparently, they also developed after Call of Pripyat, the third Stalker game, Cossacks

Phil: Cossacks ?

Phil: Was that like Stalker ?

Tom: It's a real time strategy game for PC.

Phil: Oh, really?

Phil: Is it based on the Stalker universe or just a whole new thing?

Tom: It's a remake of Cossacks European Wars.

Tom: So I think it is unrelated to the Stalker universe.

Phil: Okay, so that's a bit confusing.

Phil: I bet some one of the developers had something to do with the original.

Tom: In fact, they apparently developed the original Cossacks game.

Phil: Well, it's always fun to go back to the things that you've started, I guess.

Phil: I'm surprised that you didn't know about that.

Phil: You're not really a real-time strategy type guy, right?

Tom: I do enjoy real-time strategy games, but I haven't played that many of them.

Phil: Yeah, might pique your interest to go have a look at that one.

Phil: And Cossacks

Phil: Speaking of Cossacks, the UK retailer Game, which I think is somehow related to EB Games and an American Game stop, is stopping taking trade-ins next month, and they're going to sell through their traded games, and then no longer offer traded games at all.

Phil: So there's only one other retailer in the UK that has not yet stated whether they are going to follow Game in this manner.

Phil: But yeah, I guess that's the death knell, and it's kind of funny because as I was talking to people in our community about this, for years who have been ardent physical-only protagonists, I guess, or antagonists, depending on what side you're on, they've all gone, well, digital is kind of convenient, and there's a lot less clutter.

Phil: I think something like % of the games being purchased for the current gen are being bought digital only.

Phil: We've all made the switch years ago, if not over a decade, on the PC side to digital only.

Phil: So I guess this is coming.

Phil: Probably only collectors' items and limited runs, I would imagine, are in the future until they actually take the drives out of these consoles.

Tom: Quite possibly.

Tom: I think the actually, and even more interesting aspect of this is, I would have assumed that the trade-ins of games, given the very little money that you receive when trading in a game, would be one of the few ways they were managing to remain profitable.

Phil: Yeah, it really was a rivers of gold type situation for them, because you take a game in, they give you $for it, they turn around and sell it for $or whatever.

Phil: I mean, that's quite normal at these kinds of stores.

Phil: So I just don't know if it's just the volume isn't there anymore.

Tom: It must be that not enough people are buying them.

Phil: Not enough people are buying physical media, otherwise they wouldn't be doing everything.

Phil: I don't know if you've been into a retail video game store lately, but I would say easily less than a quarter of the store is dedicated to things other than physical media.

Tom: I've noticed walking past them that there appears to be a much larger focus on merchandise as opposed to actual games.

Phil: Yeah, yeah.

Phil: So, yeah, I mean, it's obviously inevitable and sad.

Phil: Well, it's sad for me because I've always found buying used games to be a great way to buy games that I otherwise would not have.

Phil: And in just buying physical games, I buy a lot of physical new games as well, particularly for Switch because of lack of internet connectivity where I am in Australia.

Phil: And I don't think the infrastructure where I live is going to catch up before the death of physical media.

Phil: I don't think the console manufacturers particularly care.

Phil: And why would they?

Phil: I mean, the users are telling them what's important to them.

Phil: So, yeah, anyway, I think it's just a sign of the times.

Phil: In two years, I'd be surprised if there are any physical game retailers as we want to know them.

Tom: I think it shows that console players must not be as thrifty as PC gamers, because I haven't bought a console game in a while now, but the last time I was looking, I did notice, maybe this has changed very recently, but I'm not sure if it has.

Tom: I noticed that there's still a gap between these sorts of sales that you get on consoles compared to on Steam, both in terms of frequency and discount.

Tom: But in physical stores, the price of used games was much closer to what you would find in a Steam sale.

Tom: So it's surprising in some ways that this is the case, given that the physical copies appear to be, from my experience, better value than buying digitally.

Phil: And that might be just motivated from retailers trying to free up space, free up floor space.

Phil: What have we done with these boxes everywhere?

Phil: Okay, well, that was the Week in News.

Phil: So with that, I guess we'll get into what we've been playing, or more importantly, what you've been playing.

Phil: Which one do you feel most passionate about this week, Tom?

Tom: Well, we should surely go with what is the game of the moment in Baldur's Gate

Phil: So you've been playing it on PC, I'm guessing?

Tom: That's correct.

Tom: I've been playing it via a friend's GOG account.

Tom: Yep.

Tom: And unlike most GOG games, which are all, of course, DRM-free, I'm not sure you can quite say it is DRM-free.

Tom: It's DRM-free in the sense that I can be playing his copy of the game, but it's not DRM-free in the sense that I can just download it and play it, because I needed to use the GOG Galaxy interface for one step of this process.

Tom: And whenever I open the game, it automatically opens GOG Galaxy and Larian's own launcher.

Tom: And I'm yet to figure out a way where I can launch it without opening GOG Galaxy.

Tom: So I personally would categorize that as a form of DRM, even if it's not restricting me from playing it in this potentially questionable manner.

Phil: You haven't gotten into impressions yet, so maybe if we dip our toes back into the news on this topic, because Larian, this last week, we didn't talk about it in the news, but a Ubisoft spokesperson who is in charge of digital sales and subscriptions basically said that gamers need to get used to the fact that they don't own their games, and ownership of games isn't important.

Phil: They can just use subscription services.

Phil: So sort of kind of what we've just been talking about.

Phil: And then the head of Larian came back and said, if you're waiting for our game to go to a subscription service, hell will freeze over before that happens.

Phil: We are not going to put our game on to a subscription service.

Phil: Now, this is probably in large part because Larian did have this game originally, Baldur's Gate as part of the Amazon Stadium, or Google Stadia, rather.

Phil: So their game was going to be a Google Stadia exclusive, and then of course that whole thing fell over, which was probably a good thing for them because it gave them more money to develop the game to the standard that it's currently in, which you'll tell us about soon.

Phil: And some of the responses that prompted this Ubisoft comment of, well, gamers just need to get used to the fact that they don't need to own their games.

Phil: You know, some have said, well, if I can't, is it piracy if I'm taking what cannot be owned?

Phil: Right?

Phil: Which I thought was an interesting philosophical question.

Phil: If no one owns the games, then what's stopping someone who's smart enough to figure out how to evade the kinds of mechanisms that you're talking about from doing it?

Tom: Well, I think the subtext here is that the publisher still owns the game, but you don't get to own a copy of it.

Phil: Right.

Phil: And they get to sell the access to the game.

Tom: That's right.

Phil: So they're not selling you the game, they're selling you the access to the game.

Tom: They're renting it to you.

Phil: Yeah, but you look at the copy I've got over there in the archive of some Bethesda game, I forget which one, where I've got the physical disc.

Phil: I paid cash money for it.

Phil: It wasn't a used game.

Phil: I put it in, and for whatever reason, I don't want to download the gig patch.

Phil: So they say, well, you can't play the game that's on the disc.

Phil: Well, so I guess I don't own it then.

Phil: I guess I own you guys telling me, well, I own the disc, and that's it.

Phil: But they still have the key as to whether or not I can play the game, whether I update it, which I completely understand if it's an online shooter, online game, we're cheating, and blah, blah, blah.

Phil: But it's Mad Max Fury Road.

Phil: It's like a single person action shooter.

Phil: So it's broken.

Tom: This is just an immersive ARG layer they've added to the game.

Phil: Yeah.

Phil: Oh, by the way, I'm still installing Control, the game that I bought on sale in

Phil: I download a little bit more of the update every week.

Tom: What are you up to now?

Phil: I'm up to the point where I can play it, but the game's broken and it doesn't have a lot of textures.

Phil: So, yeah, I'll get there.

Tom: Well, credit to them for letting you play the game before it's even fully downloaded, whereas Mad Max won't even let you play it off their disc.

Phil: Well, if the game is on the disc, I installed it, but they're like, no, you need to update, man.

Phil: I'm like, all right, I'll update.

Phil: And yeah, in the interim, while I've been installing their game, Remedy has released Alan Wake so I'm a little bit behind with my Remedy games.

Tom: You should probably start installing that now.

Phil: I should probably start installing that now so we can talk about it in two years.

Phil: Baldur's Gate you may as well start now with your impressions.

Phil: We'll pretend all of that was the news section.

Tom: I'll preface my impressions by stating, I'm not the biggest Western RPG fan.

Tom: There are some that I enjoy a lot, but I think a lot of them have just not ground me at all, including the so-called classics.

Tom: For instance, Neverwinter Nights, I found to be utterly boring and barely progressed out of the tutorial.

Tom: And I tried to get into the first two witches and could not, even though I enjoyed, ultimately enjoyed the third one a great deal, despite all of my problems with it.

Tom: So I may not be the best person to be providing impressions for it.

Tom: I just want to preface my impressions with that.

Phil: Right, and this one follows the more classic, so far as I know, I haven't played Battle Royale Skate but this one follows the more classic top-down, isometric type view RPG, is that right?

Tom: That's correct, and it also has more over D&D elements in it as well.

Phil: Yeah, yeah, which I absolutely love, because I played a bunch of those games in the PlayStation PSP era, and absolutely loved them.

Phil: The games that were done by Obsidian, that went on to do Pills of Eternity and other such things, so I'm a massive fan.

Phil: It's like a Diablo-type style, right?

Tom: Yeah, pretty much.

Tom: Not in terms of gameplay though, just in terms of the perspective.

Tom: The gameplay, unlike Diablo, is turn-based, or is very different?

Phil: Oh, okay, so this is turn-based, okay.

Phil: Well, that is different.

Tom: And thinking about it though, actually, there are, I think, enough Western RPGs that I love, such as, another one comes to mind, is Kotor, the original one, Jade Empire, Scepterra Core.

Tom: So I remove my preface and say that I, unlike most Western RPG fans, actually have standards and desire a great game.

Tom: That's how I'm going to justify what I'll be saying.

Phil: What about Fallout Las Vegas and Mass Effect?

Tom: The first-person Fallouts I have only briefly played.

Tom: I enjoyed the opening to Fallout but I think I just got out of the vault, and that was it, because I was playing that at my cousin's house.

Tom: And I was also playing Mass Effect at my cousin's house, and I enjoyed that, but again, I did not get very far into it.

Phil: So what should we change the name of the show?

Phil: Is that Tom Towers plays other people's games at other people's houses?

Tom: And at my own.

Tom: I'm playing Baldur's Gate here at my own house, but it's not my game.

Phil: Okay, but it's not your game.

Phil: This is fantastic.

Phil: All right, so Baldur's Gate it's a phenomenal success, won many Game of the Year awards everywhere.

Tom: It's touted as being the best RPG by many people, and I would go as far to say some people are sort of tentatively saying it's the best game of all time due to its breadth, I would say.

Phil: Right, so it's got branching paths in terms of its story.

Tom: And it's very long, very, very long.

Phil: And it's apparently flawless in terms of its technical execution as well.

Tom: That's what they say.

Tom: But I'm not sure I would agree, although I am a few patches behind.

Tom: But if they've been patching it, I don't think you could say that.

Tom: I have run into quite a few crashes, particularly when I'm on the leveling screen.

Tom: I've also run into quite a few frustrating glitches where I'll be entering a conversation, and everyone just stands around for two or three minutes before the conversation actually begins and things like that.

Tom: So I've also had some saves disappear as well, which was very frustrating.

Tom: That resulted in me losing, I think, a few hours of time at one point.

Tom: So I don't think you can say it is technically flawless.

Tom: But compared to, say, The Witcher early on, it's certainly a lot better than that.

Tom: Again, I think maybe we're dealing with RPG standards.

Tom: I mean, it's being compared to The Witcher, to Elder Scrolls.

Phil: Cyberpunk.

Tom: Cyberpunk.

Tom: So it's being compared to games that are released in a completely broken form and that have some pretty questionable gameplay elements and issues with depth to them as well, but are still loved by fans of the genre.

Tom: So I think we have to question what sort of standards are being applied to it at times as well.

Phil: Fair enough.

Phil: Fair enough.

Phil: So it's not to Nintendo standards where it just comes out of the box with no updates.

Phil: Absolutely correct.

Tom: Not at all.

Phil: You never need to do anything.

Phil: Not at all.

Phil: Which is what you'd expect for such a complex game.

Tom: Yeah, I think when you consider the size of it, it's understandable.

Tom: Whereas when you consider some of the bullshit going on in The Witcher or Elder Scrolls or what have you in the world of RPGs and their broken releases, it's definitely well beyond them.

Tom: But that doesn't mean that it is a flawless release or release to the standard of games in other genres.

Phil: OK, so before I ask any more specific questions, maybe you can just give us a loose, you know, minute by minute, OK, you're playing the game.

Phil: What is the hook?

Phil: What are you doing?

Phil: Just give us a general overview for those who haven't played it or at least they haven't heard your impression of it, and I think that's valuable enough for us to have a rehash of it.

Tom: Well, the thing that stands out early on, which is without a doubt one of the best things in the game and is definitely on another level compared to, I think, most RPGs.

Tom: I can't really think of one that does this as well off the top of my head.

Tom: So it's got all of the D&D rules with different elements being strong against one another and needing to know all this encyclopedic knowledge of how skills interact with other skills and different enemies and all of this sort of stuff.

Tom: But in addition to that, the way the environment works is sort of like a lighter version of something like XCOM or other turn-based strategy games.

Tom: So any difficult battle you're in, you are going to be needing to use the environment to your advantage.

Tom: And this can be a basic thing like knowing how you want your companions and yourself to be arranged on the battlefield to making sure that you have the high ground so that you have the advantage against ranged attacks and have the advantage if you're using someone using ranged attacks against people who might be trying to get in close and attack you in Malay.

Tom: So if you're looking at it from the perspective of a turn-based strategy game, it's the basic sort of stuff that those games are built on, but put in a D&D RPG combat system.

Tom: So it is an extremely engrossing and enjoyable combination.

Tom: And the fun thing about it is it doesn't stop there.

Tom: It goes beyond it and keeps what I think is one of the enjoyable aspects of Western RPGs, is the way you figure out how to take advantage of these things and turn it into a ridiculous and comical cheese fest.

Tom: I think that's always been what makes what would otherwise be a completely uninteresting combat system in Elder Scrolls, for example, enjoyable, is it's not about the janky and awkward combat mechanics.

Phil: Terrible and atrocious combat.

Tom: That's right.

Tom: It's about figuring out the most ridiculous solutions to any given battle.

Tom: And that is the case here.

Tom: You can do things like you're coming up to, I think a good example of this is, when you're invading early on this goblin fortress, depending on what path you're taking, you're there to kill three of the goblin leaders.

Tom: And one of them, at one point, it's near, she's near a bridge, and instead of fighting her, you can just simply throw her off the bridge out of combat.

Tom: And so that's a great solution.

Phil: You know, it was like that, that had the same sort of spirit.

Phil: What was that Lord of the Rings games?

Phil: You know, the ones that had the...

Tom: The third person action RPG ones?

Phil: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Phil: Oh, God, what can I remember?

Tom: I know what you're talking about.

Tom: I never played them.

Phil: Yeah, those were fantastic in terms of, you know, basically giving you an open mission and then you having to figure out how to actually do it.

Phil: And you could do it in any way possible.

Phil: And I just can't think of the name of it.

Phil: That's driving me crazy.

Phil: And I'm sure it's driving our listenership crazy as well, because I played through both of them.

Phil: And because, you know, the fun of it was, well, it encompasses the whole concept of play.

Phil: That's what play is about.

Phil: Play is about improvisation.

Phil: Play is about limited resources.

Phil: Play is about tripping someone when you can't win fair.

Phil: Or, you know, at least it is to me.

Phil: So, no, so they really captured that.

Tom: Absolutely.

Tom: And I'll correct myself.

Tom: I actually tried to play the first one on my old PC, and you had to have a DirectX, I think, or it might have been video card.

Tom: And I had a DirectX video card, so it locked me out of playing it, even though my video card probably would have been perfectly capable of running it.

Tom: And I made it into the menu and launched the game at frames per second.

Tom: So that was a proud achievement, figuring out a way to get into that game.

Tom: And I think that fits with what you were saying about the core tenet there of the gameplay, where you're figuring out unorthodox solutions to problems.

Tom: Even in being able to launch the game, they carried that through, so well done to them there.

Tom: That's a step above Baldur's Gate I think, where you have to use the GOG Galaxy Launcher to play it.

Tom: But this aspect, as I was saying, that continues throughout the whole game.

Tom: And the only area where they sort of fall down in the combat is, as they are increasing the difficulty of the combat, you run into more and more battles that are not so much about them coming up with interesting environmental elements that you can play in, but are more about just throwing a million enemies at you.

Tom: And for me anyway, that's a problem for two things.

Tom: One, it kind of forces you to be playing in a certain way, because then area of effect attacks become much more important, and you have to really focus on them in most battles, even if you had a different way you might have wanted to approach it.

Tom: And two, more importantly, it is turn-based.

Tom: So if you've got literally, say, enemies, you've got to sit there and wait for enemies to go through their fucking turns, where they may not even be doing anything interesting.

Tom: They're just dashing across the environment, because they begin two football fields away.

Tom: And you've got to sit through this, watching them dash along at the normal speed of the game.

Tom: And it's just, for me anyway, it just not only adds an uninteresting element of difficulty to the combat, it also adds a totally unnecessary time factor where essentially nothing is happening.

Tom: And it's just getting in the way of you concentrating on the enjoyable things about combat, which is figuring out what your strategy is, both in the moment and in the battle as a whole.

Phil: It sounds like a lot of good elements being brought together.

Phil: As a writer, I know you're always critical of the writing in games.

Phil: Are you critical of the writing in Stalker?

Tom: I think the writing in Stalker is some of the best writing in a game, because a lot of it is not done in writing, pretty much.

Tom: So that's why I said the narrative in Stalker is incredible.

Tom: The environmental storytelling in it is second to none, without a doubt.

Tom: And the atmosphere and the world they create is just totally engrossing and immersive, and open enough that if it's the sort of environment that clicks with you, you can add to it whatever thematic sort of feelings that you have at the time that you're playing it, which is one of the signs of the best sort of writing, in my opinion.

Phil: So the writing in this game, does it work for you?

Phil: Because a lot of people have been talking about how fantastic the narrative is, or I don't know if they're caught up on the gimmick of the branching paths, or the great stories and the side quests, but a lot of people are enjoying the game other than just the game mechanics and the world that it's set in.

Tom: Well, I think where it excels is with some of the companion characters, but definitely not all of them.

Tom: A couple of them have very interesting backstories that are nicely woven into the way that the main plot is progressing.

Tom: So as you're going along following the main story, their stories will be tangentially related to it, and some of them more directly related to it than others.

Tom: And so you'll have these several different stories unfolding simultaneously in a very seamless manner, with each revealing a little bit about one another in a complementary way.

Tom: That aspect of it is very enjoyable.

Tom: I think one area that I was pretty disappointed in the writing was the detail, because I was expecting, you know, all of these minor little things to alter how certain things were going to play out.

Tom: But even on a level, a basic level, where you would expect that to be the case, and in some areas that is the case, but many areas it isn't.

Tom: And this is probably the most egregious example.

Tom: In a lot of the dialogue trees, no matter which character you're using, whether you're using your avatar character or one of the companions, the dialogue options will actually be the same.

Tom: And I think that is a pretty big oversight, to say the least, because to the credit of the writing, the characters themselves are actually all very different.

Tom: And when they're interacting in a more detailed area that is more related to a specific character, they'll be true to their voice.

Tom: But then at the same time, you'll have these other interactions, some of which are related to the main story.

Tom: And it won't be about the character's voice.

Tom: It will just be this sort of generic voice that they've created for the avatar character instead, which I thought was pretty lazy and disappointing.

Tom: And I understand that to do this in what is a to -hour game is obviously a gargantuan task, to say the least.

Tom: But it is absolutely something that sticks out a bit like a sore thumb, particularly given that elsewhere they do go the extra mile in terms of that sort of detail.

Phil: Now, you're playing this on a pretty good PC gaming rig, I'm assuming?

Tom: Correct, yep.

Phil: So visually, I'm sure it looks fantastic.

Tom: It does.

Tom: I think one issue I have with the look, which we can also tie into the writing a little bit, is I think it's lacking a lot in terms of, I think, originality, both in a good way and a bad way, but also, I think, it's hard to articulate this exactly, but if I compare this to something like The Witcher in terms of the characters and storytelling, both aesthetically and in terms of the writing, with The Witcher, one of the best things about it, which puts it on another level to the majority of games and allowed me to put up with the, at times, horrendously annoying gameplay, is, I think the simplest way to put it is, everyone in Baldur's Gate no matter what the character is, looks like a protagonist film star, essentially.

Tom: And that applies to the environment design and the flaws of the characters and how the characters behave.

Tom: Everyone is this perfectly polished model who behaves perfectly, even if they're doing bad things, to what the expectations of a nice version of this character would be.

Tom: Whereas in The Witcher that's not the case at all.

Tom: The characters in that feel and look, to a degree at least, more so like real people.

Tom: And that's also to some degree a matter of taste because doing it this way in Baldur's Gate is, I suppose, better for escapism.

Tom: But I think the best examples of writing or art, if we're talking about the aesthetic qualities of Baldur's Gate if they want to be escapist, and The Witcher absolutely is, has a great escapist element to it, it should also be able to add, I think, a better element of depth to it as well, even if it's focused on escapism.

Phil: The name of the game I couldn't remember was Shadows of Mordor, and the reason why I bring that up is that there was a lot more digital diversity, if you will, in terms of the characters in that game.

Phil: I mean, there was not a pretty face in that entire game other than for, well, the guy you were playing, of course, as a player.

Tom: So it accurately represents the players.

Phil: Exactly.

Phil: Yeah, it made me feel like I was the troll.

Tom: Made you feel like you were there.

Phil: Yeah, but this sort of thing, and it could not possibly be the first time we talk about it, is something that really does drive me nuts, even though I'm not particularly sensitive to this sort of stuff in media.

Phil: I just like to have people look more like regular people.

Phil: And, you know, do you want that in your fantasy RPG?

Phil: Probably not.

Phil: In your fantasy RPG, you probably want to look like, you want everyone to look like they've just, you know, conquered something or come in from some palace, I guess.

Phil: But I think it is a major crutch, a casting crutch, just to go, oh, well, this person's not important.

Phil: That's why they look a little bit funny and they're ugly and fat, you know.

Phil: Not to overplay that too much.

Phil: But we've talked a fair bit about the game.

Tom: I think that applies more so to the world of film, though.

Phil: Yeah.

Tom: I think if you're the one digitally creating the characters, you're making them to look a certain way as opposed to who you can afford to play them.

Phil: That's right.

Phil: But the problem is, at least it used to be the problem, that a lot of game developers were, you know, pervs.

Phil: And, you know, they'd make the Lara Crofts and the things like that.

Phil: And you know, you look at things like Soul Calibur and things like Dead or Alive, you know, where basically they'd create these fantasy toys that they could play with, right?

Phil: And I think if a game has the depth that you're talking about with Baldur's Gate that maybe it would have had more depth, or it undercuts the depth of the narrative and everything else if everyone you're talking to looks like a movie star, right?

Tom: Well, I'm saying everyone in Baldur's Gate does look like a movie star.

Phil: Yeah, and that's what I'm saying.

Phil: And that sort of undercuts the great work they've done in every other sphere of the game.

Tom: Exactly.

Phil: You could say, well, it's a fantasy RPG, what do you want here?

Phil: And you go, well, yeah, but is it really credible that the troll I'm talking to looks like the Rock, or this witch looks like a famous actress name here?

Phil: So yeah, that's probably the closest thing I've heard of you in terms of a criticism for this game, that I've just put in your mouth.

Phil: Anything else for bubbles?

Tom: It's definitely a criticism because I think when we're...

Tom: And it's only a criticism that I bring up, given that the standard we're comparing it to is that it is meant to be the greatest RPG ever made and one of the greatest games ever made.

Tom: So that's the standard we're holding it to.

Tom: So when we're thinking about it in those terms, we've got to be considering, does the aesthetic stand up and the narrative stand up to something like The Witcher ?

Tom: And for me, I don't think it's quite there.

Tom: It is...

Tom: If we're not thinking about it in those terms, it's absolutely enjoyable.

Tom: The characters...

Tom: There's definitely some inconsistencies in how interesting they are and how well written they are compared to one another in terms of the main companions you have.

Tom: But the ones that are good take you on a rollicking and engrossing and very enjoyable journey.

Tom: I think the main plot could be a lot more interesting, but I think that's a fundamental issue with the genre itself.

Tom: I can't really think of, other than maybe Scepterra Core and The Witcher except the only reason it's an interesting main story in The Witcher is because of how poorly it is told, by which I mean the main story in The Witcher is actually not this massive epic quest.

Tom: It's this pretty short thing that has a large focus on the character drama between Geralt and characters he knows.

Tom: And for like two-thirds of the game, it's not there.

Tom: The actual story that's being told is focused on the main quest.

Tom: I think if you are trying to write an epic fantasy story that is going to last the length of these sorts of games, you're going to have to find an exceptionally talented fantasy novelist, and they're not going to write a fucking video game.

Tom: So I don't think that's going to happen.

Phil: Look, video games, movies, whatever you're talking about, the main story is never...

Phil: In movies, probably a little bit better, but when you're talking about fantasy games, there's never a grand story.

Phil: It's always what the player brings to it and molds their own story.

Tom: What it ends up becoming about is basically all the side stories that are recurring at the same time, that the main plot is basically an excuse to push you in the direction of.

Phil: Yeah, exactly.

Phil: Yeah, so yeah, I wouldn't judge any of these games by their story.

Phil: The games where I do judge their story are games like The Last of Us, where they are in control of pretty much every single element of the story.

Phil: And it's like, OK, well, if you guys are driving, the destination better be good, and it better match what you've been promising the whole way, which was part of my problem with The Last of Us that we never talked about.

Phil: But yeah, like if you're steering, it better be a good destination.

Phil: But if you're giving us a toolbox to play in, main story, main plot doesn't really matter that much.

Tom: I would agree.

Tom: And one thing I appreciate about the aesthetic and the writing as well, I said it's a bit generic before, but that's also one of its strengths, because it's generic in the strength, in the sense that it is pulling from a lot of different influences.

Tom: And it does it in an interesting way, because they're not the sort of influences you'd necessarily see coming together.

Tom: The main antagonist of the game is essentially Cthulhu, but this is combined with characters that look like they're straight out of a fantasy anime, for example.

Tom: So it's the way it uses its influences creates an interesting collage that you don't find in, I think, many fantasy products, whether they're games or otherwise.

Tom: So that's something that I really appreciate about it as well.

Tom: And overall, I mean, I'm now getting, I think I'm probably around hours almost into it.

Tom: I'm still playing it.

Tom: So that says something for it at the very least.

Phil: Oh, big time.

Phil: That's fantastic.

Phil: I'm glad you're enjoying it.

Tom: And the one thing I would add as well, which I appreciate a lot, and I wish more RPGs in particular did this, this game absolutely is % in support of save scumming.

Tom: You can quick save wherever you want, including at any point in battle.

Tom: You can also quick save during conversations.

Tom: And for something that has so many different branching options and things that can occur, and also for something that has a random element to the combat in the sense that it's all based on dice rolls, I think that makes the experience a lot more enjoyable because you can then experiment with whatever you want in terms of seeing how any specific moment will play out.

Tom: And if you get five different shitty rolls in a row that should not be occurring, you can just reload and go back a few turns in a battle.

Phil: I would expect nothing less.

Phil: I mean, that's really a part of the genre.

Tom: A lot of RPGs do not support that, though.

Tom: Not to the same degree anyway.

Phil: Yeah, Western RPGs anyway.

Phil: But yeah, Western RPGs turn-based, I think so.

Phil: But yeah, I'll defer to you on that one.

Phil: Okay, well, any closing thoughts for Baldur's Gate ?

Tom: I think that's probably it for now.

Phil: Well, bringing endorsement, I'm just wondering what I could play it on.

Tom: Well, it's on all the current consoles, I think.

Tom: And PC.

Tom: And the PC download is only without patches, I think around gigabytes, so it shouldn't be a problem for you.

Phil: Yeah, no, that's no problem.

Phil: I'd just not be able to use the internet for two months, but hey, you know, that's the price you gotta pay.

Tom: You wouldn't be able to finish downloading Control.

Phil: Okay, well, thanks for that.

Phil: Before we get into questions for Tom, I was wondering if there's any of the games on my list that you're interested in, me giving you any sort of impressions?

Tom: I think the one that stands out the most for me is Paper Mario The Origami Killer.

Phil: Yes, Paper Mario The Origami Killer.

Phil: Now, I can't remember the actual name, if you can look that up for me, but this is obviously the most recent entry in the Paper Mario series.

Tom: I believe it is The Origami King.

Tom: I'm not as interested now.

Phil: Okay, that's fine.

Phil: There's a whole lot less surreptitiously taken video of famous Hollywood actresses snuck into the game.

Phil: So, as opposed to like Heavy Rain in all of his games, they're still around, I think, aren't they?

Phil: The makers of Heavy Rain.

Phil: They just didn't get picked up by Sony.

Phil: In any case, Quantic Dream, yeah.

Phil: Paper Mario, The Origami King.

Phil: So, I went into this game going, my god, this thing has been polished within an inch of its life.

Phil: It was so hold your handy sort of thing for the first like hour and a half.

Phil: But of course, you know, I've played all of the Paper Marios, right?

Phil: From the original None, which was inspired by the Square Enix game, Super Mario RPG, which come full circle has now been released before Christmas, and also had great commercial and critical success.

Phil: Super Mario RPG was my number one most favorite game for quite a long time.

Phil: And for the NES, Super NES rather.

Phil: And so when the Paper Mario series came along, I of course bought the Nversion immediately, and was obviously disappointed.

Phil: But then, you know, they did do some really great creative work with it, and it's a fantastic series, really.

Phil: Most people's favorite is the Thousand Year Door.

Phil: I'm probably a bigger fan of the original, but this Paper Mario, the Origami King for the Switch, turns out to be fantastic.

Phil: After you get through that initial handholdy thing, which for most people isn't going to apply, because it may be the first time you've ever played an RPG.

Phil: You know, this could be the entry point for a lot of people who have a Switch, who might be younger, who have never played a turn-based JRPG.

Phil: And it follows the turn-based JRPG model very closely, except in the boss battles, they're kind of timed puzzle-based battles where you have to really be creative in how you get through it.

Phil: I can see how some older players might find the battle system cumbersome, because it is like a puzzle as you're going through it.

Phil: You've got to change your tactics.

Phil: You've got to be really selective in terms of the items that you use and how many steps you move.

Phil: And ultimately, the dialogue in this...

Phil: This is a quick review, by the way.

Phil: The dialogue is also very clever and snappy.

Phil: It doesn't take itself too seriously at all.

Phil: It's constantly poking fun at the world of Mario and of JPGs as well.

Phil: And it was a fairly good length, too.

Phil: I think it was about -plus hours.

Phil: But what I really loved about it was the real-time battle system.

Phil: So even though it was turn-based, it was timed, so there was a timed element to it.

Phil: So yeah, overall, I have nothing but positive things to say about The Origami King.

Phil: I thought it was a fantastic entry in the series, and probably, if I'm being truthful, probably the best one in the series, when you take away, scrub away all the nostalgia.

Phil: But yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Tom: Is the combat similar to the Gamecube Paper Mario The Thousand Year Reich?

Phil: The Thousand Year Reich, no.

Phil: No, it's completely novel and different, and you really have to see a video of it.

Phil: I'd encourage people just to go on to YouTube and watch it for themselves.

Phil: Again, if it's not the only game that you're playing, and if you're older and you can't quite, you know, keep up with, oh, my God, what is this doing in my JRPG?

Phil: It might be a little bit off-putting, but it's actually very, very creative, and the battles are very creative as well.

Phil: So, you know, you'll go up against pencil cases, erasers.

Phil: It's all origami-themed, it's all craftwork-themed, not the band, but, you know, paper, folding paper and drawing and all that sort of thing.

Phil: And a fairly good sense of humor throughout the whole game.

Tom: My only issue with it is that your eras have made it seem a lot more interesting than the actual description of it, from the origami killer to a craftwork theme.

Tom: Ha ha ha!

Phil: With a craftwork with a K.

Phil: Yep.

Phil: We should probably end up our games impressions, even though you've got a lot of games on your list, but we can get to them next time, as do I.

Phil: I...

Phil: any...

Phil: Now, you know, we get a lot of questions about our trademark banner.

Phil: Now, you cannot listen to a podcast these days without them bringing up banter.

Tom: Something they undoubtedly got from us.

Phil: Yeah, well, the giant bomb splinter group that started a podcast actually referred to it in an episode as the other day as their trademark banter section.

Phil: Okay?

Tom: Yep.

Phil: So, look, it was only a one-off mention, but it was mentioned.

Phil: Then there's another podcast I listen to that goes out of their way to say, okay, now we're talking, you know, this is our banter section.

Phil: So I thought I'd give all the podcast world a little bit of a reverse from it.

Phil: But before we go into listener questions for Tom from other people's podcasts, anything happen to you lately that would make the listener think that you and I are friends and that we're real people that interact in a completely wholesome and natural way?

Tom: I'm not sure if there's anything that would make them think that we interact and are real friends.

Tom: That's more difficult, I think.

Tom: Real people, I'm not sure either, because the only thing I had related to this was an incident involving an insurance company in which I was the person who benefited financially from it rather than the insurance company, which sounds very unrealistic.

Phil: That's relatable, at least.

Phil: I mean, people hate insurance companies.

Phil: They're there to rip you off and steal from you, so it's fantastic that you got one over on them.

Phil: Are you sure you want to disclose this on the air, though?

Tom: Well, it's all perfectly legal.

Phil: No fraud is required.

Phil: As someone who has had a non-fault accident and haven't got my car repaired in six months while they wait for the parts to arrive from Korea, I'm very interested in hearing and someone getting over on an insurance company.

Tom: Well, I've got a Honda Integra, and I live in Richmond.

Tom: Now, if you know what a Honda Integra is, and...

Phil: No one told me there would be boasting.

Tom: It's only the GSI.

Tom: It's the non-VTEC version.

Phil: That's all right.

Phil: OK, so your classic car, yes?

Tom: Yep, my classic car.

Tom: In Richmond.

Tom: And if anyone knows where Richmond is in Melbourne...

Phil: It's a bunch of millionaires, people.

Tom: It is, but it's a bunch of millionaires and a bunch of council housing and probably the heroin capital of Melbourne.

Phil: Well, that's what the sign says, but, you know, it's been quite a few years.

Tom: That's what's there on the City of Melbourne's website.

Tom: Attracting tourists.

Phil: You know, the number one cocaine use per capita in the globe, since we're in trademark beta, we can do about whatever we want.

Phil: Here's Australia.

Phil: I don't even know how that works.

Tom: That explains why it's so expensive here.

Phil: Well, I guess.

Phil: Anyway, back to your tale.

Tom: So, I think heroin is probably cheaper than cocaine.

Tom: But the price of cocaine is what is encouraging all the Matthews.

Tom: But in any case, so Richmond, despite being a very expensive area now, which is a rather bizarre change over the past years, to say the least, there, if you can't walk down certain streets without seeing the road lined with glass from cars' windows being broken into.

Tom: And Honda's, Honda Integra's and Civics of this era are very popular cars to steal for two reasons.

Tom: One, they're very fun to go and enjoy rides in.

Tom: And two, there is a constant very high demand for any sorts of parts related to them.

Phil: Definitely, yeah.

Phil: Because they're the only cars from that era that are still going.

Phil: I had a Honda Civic.

Phil: It was a lot of fun to drive.

Phil: And I can completely understand why people would want to steal.

Phil: Well, stealing parts even back then was a thing.

Phil: When I was in California, for Civics, it was kind of like, yeah, you can get one.

Phil: But because they were always getting involved in crashes from races, street racing, and all the rest of it.

Phil: So it was like, if you had one, it was like, yeah, you're going to be having to secure it pretty well.

Phil: Don't tell me you're integral broken into.

Tom: Well, it got not only broken into, but someone attempted to steal it twice.

Tom: I went out there one day out the front, and is parked out front in front of the house.

Tom: And I should add additionally, our cousins while visiting once, their car was stolen out the front of our house at like between to p.m.

Phil: Well, I don't want to one up you, but I had a friend come and visit me in California once, and I used to live in the Slater Slums, which is not the name of the town, that's just what that area was called.

Phil: And when they went back to their car, it had bullet holes in the door.

Phil: Not because they were trying to shoot their way into the car, just because it was in the background.

Phil: It was just there while they were shooting someone else.

Phil: Again, not to one up you.

Phil: Is this the same cousins that you went over to play your video games at?

Tom: Correct, exactly.

Phil: Just to close the loop, just so everyone at home knows we were listening to.

Tom: The same cousins, the Mass Effect Fallout cousins.

Phil: And the Virtua Tennis Dreamcast cousins, possibly?

Tom: No.

Phil: Oh, bummer.

Tom: I think they had a demo of Virtua Tennis on PC, though.

Phil: Okay.

Phil: Well, I remember you were recounting once that you loved playing Virtua Tennis with friends or whatever when it came out in the Dreamcast because of the ridiculous nature of the rallies.

Phil: And is the Australian Open this week, everyone?

Tom: It is indeed.

Tom: So I go out there, I open the door, and I see that the front seat has been pushed back.

Tom: There's some random...

Tom: the glovebox is open and random detritus around in the passenger seat.

Phil: So it was a tall seat.

Tom: And it takes me a few minutes to realize someone's tried to steal this.

Tom: And I thought they're probably trying to steal the car, given that they didn't break the windows, and given that they were relatively careful in attempting in breaking the locks.

Tom: They'd used a pair of scissors and not done too much damage to the paint.

Tom: And I assume they probably thought this being a car from the s, didn't have an immobilizer, because immobilizers were only mandated in the s in Australia.

Phil: I'm sorry, you lost me there.

Phil: What's an immobilizer?

Tom: An immobilizer means the car can't be hot-wired because it requires the key to be in the ignition for it to be able to start.

Phil: Oh, okay.

Phil: But couldn't you put a screwdriver in there?

Phil: Or the key has to be all the way in?

Tom: In theory, it has to be the correct key.

Phil: All right.

Phil: The things you like.

Tom: So, before calling the police, because apparently you're meant to do this, I thought there's a reasonable chance that they're going to come back and try and steal it again.

Tom: So I disconnected the battery and also removed the fuses.

Tom: And so then I ring the police, and they say...

Phil: Have you disconnected the battery and removed the fuses?

Phil: Because we are not going to be there for a while.

Tom: And so after talking to the police and receiving phone numbers for emotional support from them and all this sort of thing, I was informed...

Tom: And you also can no longer call the local police station.

Tom: You've got to call this centralized call center for them to put you in touch with...

Tom: They then talk to, I presume, the local police station or who the hell knows.

Tom: They said, yes, they might send someone out within a few days to look for fingerprints and this sort of thing.

Tom: So they end up coming out the next morning, and it's poured with rain, nonetheless, just because I think they felt they needed to do something to be earning God knows what they were to come out and try and find a car thief based on no evidence they're going to find, dusted for fingerprints on this car that has just been through torrential rain, finding nothing, took very disinterestively pieces of the scissors and left.

Phil: Oh, the scissors were there.

Tom: They left the scissors behind.

Phil: I just thought it was your tremendous Sherlock Holmes ability to discern that they had to use scissors, not that the scissors were still there.

Phil: So I'm assuming they didn't dust them for prints.

Phil: Finally, we've nabbed them.

Tom: They dusted the windows and the door handles.

Phil: Wow, that is incredible.

Phil: That's incredible.

Tom: And they took some photos as well.

Phil: Well, you know, I mean, if you're going to dust a car, you got to take some photos.

Tom: All right, so the next day, I go out to the car again, because I've got to get all my stuff out of it for when the insurance company, Toe Truck, shows up.

Tom: And so I then see it's been broken into again, because now there's more damage on the other side.

Tom: So my forethought of removing the battery and the fuses paid off, because if you have a computer, you can connect it to the car's ECU and disable the immobilizer.

Phil: Okay, so the guy's carrying on a computer and they can do all this?

Tom: Yep, so they must have.

Tom: So I assume they were stealing it for parts rather than to joyride, hence why they came back with the relevant, most likely came back with the relevant paraphernalia to disable the immobilizer.

Phil: So this is some sort of ring.

Phil: This isn't just a junkie.

Tom: Though they were clearly interested in drugs because a friend of mine had at some point done some black magic with me where you melt welding wire into a shape and from this shape you discern a particular thing that you've been thinking is related to some problem you have.

Tom: And so I had this random foil thing in my car and I did notice that that was one of the things they stole.

Tom: So I assume they thought there might have been drugs in this little bit of foil.

Phil: You know, I've never consumed mushrooms, but I assume this conversation is pretty much where, you know, would go exactly like this.

Phil: Okay, so your friends made the foil thing and they took that.

Tom: Yep.

Phil: Okay, yeah.

Tom: Like magic, not mushrooms.

Phil: So if Fast and Furious guide in, like if there was a side story movie about the people they stole the cars from, this is what we're listening to.

Phil: Exactly.

Phil: Now, a discerning person probably would have said, my car's been broken into, they're going to break into it again.

Phil: I will go through the efforts of removing all the fuses, which I think didn't need to go to that far, but you disconnected the battery.

Tom: I technically want to remove the battery fuse.

Phil: Oh, okay, okay, that's good, that's good, because you'd look like a crazy man if you took all the fuses out.

Phil: But you didn't then go, maybe I should take the valuable possessions out of the car, like the divining rod foil man I made that's predicting the future.

Phil: And was this foil man, was it predicting the future, or just telling you how you felt?

Tom: I think it was, if you've got a problem, this is related to Middle Eastern beliefs on superstitions, so it's in this case was figuring out who might have been giving her the evil eye.

Phil: Ah, so it is a defining type thing.

Phil: Okay, yeah, okay.

Phil: So you didn't think to remove these things from your car, though.

Phil: And so besides the defining foil man, what else was stolen from the car?

Tom: Well, there was essentially nothing of value in the car because...

Phil: That's not what you tell the insurance company.

Tom: Well, well, well.

Phil: We'll get to that in a moment.

Phil: We had a PlayStation had a briefcase full of money.

Tom: It turns out I probably should have committed a little insurance fraud here, as we'll get to in a moment.

Tom: But what was stolen was another friend's jacket, which I wanted to get rid of.

Tom: So that was a very foreshadowing theft.

Tom: I think the one thing that I really was annoyed about being stolen was the original rear badge, because I had removed the rear badge because it was not properly attached to the car, and I was storing it in the glove box.

Tom: So unfortunately, I can no longer say that I have both original badges on the car anymore.

Phil: Did you remove it because they made a mistake at the factory?

Phil: Like it wasn't put in the right place?

Tom: No, it was in the right place, but it was coming out because it's a -year-old car.

Tom: So I needed to add some epoxy resin or something to put it properly back in place.

Phil: While we're on this quick trademark banner thing before we get back to video game content, there's a video game, there's a car manufacturer called Havel or Great Wall, and they have these very affordable hatchback SUVs called Havels, H-A-V-A-L.

Phil: Yep.

Phil: Are you familiar with these?

Tom: The Chinese ones, right?

Phil: Exactly.

Phil: They're made by Great Wall, right?

Phil: The H-A-V are equally spaced apart, but the space between the V and the next A is bigger, and then they go back to regular spacing between the A and the L.

Phil: Now, I know you're saying this is a waste of our listenership's time, and your time too, and probably mine.

Phil: But if you are stuck behind a Havel in future, you will notice that for whatever reason, they screwed up the spacing of the letters on the back of the car.

Phil: Honda would not do this, right?

Phil: There's no H-O-N space space D-A, and that's what they've done with the Havel.

Phil: H-A-V-A space space A-L.

Phil: It is, I'm stuck behind his car, I'm like moving my head around, I'm moving either side.

Phil: I tell my friend at work, I said, your daughter's got one of these Havel cars.

Phil: Can you, you know, go measure it with a tape?

Phil: And he comes back the next day, he's like, yeah, you're right.

Phil: There's like extra space between the V and the second A.

Phil: And I would like to get to the bottom of it.

Phil: I'd like to know if this is just sheer Chinese incompetence, or if there's something in the back door, like they got a sensor or something.

Phil: So they're like, just move the other A, you know, five mils that way, no one's going to notice.

Phil: Phil Fogg noticed.

Phil: Phil Fogg noticed.

Tom: What if it's a deliberate design choice?

Phil: But you see, you're saying the badge was in the wrong place.

Phil: And that just, you know, like in the case of the Havel, yeah, that was a factory screw up.

Phil: Not a year old car.

Tom: It's in the right place.

Tom: It was just falling out.

Phil: Okay, very good.

Phil: Okay, sorry, sorry, but you'll notice now, it'll drive you nuts.

Tom: I'll look out for it next time I see a Havel.

Tom: But so the only things of any sort of value that were stolen was a very cheap torch and a cheap car vacuum cleaner.

Tom: So eventually, several days later, I think maybe five days later, they finally tow the car and take it off.

Tom: And the logical thing to do would have, of course, been to park it off the property.

Tom: But our back gate was destroyed in the last big flood we had here.

Tom: And it was going to be a long process to get the insurance to cover it, which should have been an obvious slam dunk thing for them to do.

Tom: And we had a lot of stuff going on at the time, so we never got around to it.

Tom: So we had essentially no car access to the backyard.

Tom: Or we might have considered potentially not going to the insurance and just getting it repaired because the only damage that appeared to have occurred was to the ignition barrel and to the paint.

Tom: And it was just the paint around the...

Tom: where the key goes in the door handle that was damaged.

Tom: So it might have been, if you could be bothered doing that, $to repair that and maybe, you know, $or something for the ignition barrel.

Tom: So in theory, it should be very cheap repairs.

Tom: But it goes off to the insurance company.

Tom: And bearing mind, the real value of even these non-VTEC integrals that are in good condition, which mine is in, begins at like $

Tom: But all insurance companies, except for Shannon's, will only insure them for between $to around $

Phil: Personally, I think the market value on that is like way under.

Phil: A VTEC Integra in good condition, I mean...

Tom: The VTEC ones start at about $or $

Phil: That's what I was going to say.

Phil: I would say $$$depending on the condition.

Tom: But I think the non-VTEC ones at half that price is fair.

Phil: Yeah, yeah, I agree.

Tom: The truth is, they're not going to be...

Tom: The way I would think of it is there's no way a VTEC Integra is going to be, maybe unless it's a Type R, going to be twice as fun as a non-VTEC one.

Tom: But having VTEC is an important status thing.

Phil: It is, it is.

Phil: And if you're collecting, I mean, that's what you're going to want.

Tom: Exactly.

Phil: So yeah, I'd buy that.

Tom: So I think half the sort of value is fair.

Tom: But so, that goes off to the insurance.

Tom: I don't hear anything from the insurance company for weeks.

Tom: The first thing I hear from them is that they have paid me for the stolen items in the car.

Tom: And so I go and check what they've given me.

Tom: And I'm surprised to see that they've given me...

Phil: $

Tom: What's that?

Phil: $?

Tom: I think it was more like something between $to $

Phil: Hey, see, look at me.

Tom: So I'm thinking, how the fuck is this the case?

Tom: And then I go and look at the receipts I sent them.

Tom: So I sent them the receipts, and in the emails, I said what was sold was this single vacuum cleaner, but there's a bunch of other stuff in the receipt, and this single torch, but there's a bunch of other stuff in this receipt.

Tom: And so they've just paid the total of the receipts, I suppose, to the stolen items.

Tom: So that's good, but I also discover through...

Tom: Go AI!

Tom: Through discovering this that they've written off the car.

Tom: So I ring them up, and bear in mind, if you've got a new car, if it gets written off, that's a big problem, because it destroys the value of the vehicle.

Phil: And they deregister it too.

Tom: If you've got an old car, it doesn't matter at all, because they don't deregister it, and it doesn't get put on a written off vehicle list.

Tom: So the only issue is getting the car back from the insurance.

Tom: So I ring them up, and I say, this is an absurd decision to write it off, given that the damage to the car that I could establish anyway is only a few hundred dollars, maybe.

Tom: It's not a few hundred dollars.

Tom: It's under a thousand dollars, and it's insured for, I think, it was, because the insurance amount had gone up since I originally insured it to the company's credit.

Tom: I think it went from to

Tom: So that's below their threshold of where they should be riding off a car.

Tom: As I say, what's going on?

Tom: And of course, the poor people in the Philippines don't know what's going on.

Tom: They've got to put me into touch with the people in Australia who do know what's going on.

Tom: And so I say, don't bother doing that.

Tom: Just put me straight through to who I need to talk to to open a formal dispute.

Tom: Because if you have something written off, you can open a formal dispute, so you may as well just skip ahead to that stage or you're just going to be talking to these people for God knows how long.

Tom: And to their credit, they were very helpful.

Tom: They immediately said, the way it works is you've got to talk to the assessor first and discuss it with them.

Tom: And they have the power to reverse their decision or change the details of it.

Tom: Because to give the car back to me, they want $in salvage.

Tom: So they're saying a car that they're valued at $as a working vehicle is worth $as a salvage vehicle.

Tom: I'm not sure that quite makes any sense.

Phil: Why would it?

Tom: So the next day, the assessor calls me, and I've got this page of arguments as to why this is ridiculous.

Tom: Because the one thing I forgot to say that the people in the Philippines did know was that they concluded there was $worth of repairs that needed to be done.

Tom: Because apparently the thieves had damaged the door mouldings.

Tom: They hadn't.

Tom: The car is years old, so the door mouldings look a bit crusty.

Tom: There was a long list of things that were just called, this car is years old.

Tom: Unless you're doing a show restoration, you're not doing any of this bullshit.

Tom: And it has nothing to do with the attempted theft either.

Tom: So to fully restore the car, which I think shows you, I got a very nice example.

Tom: To fully restore this car, it would only cost me $

Tom: So it was to my credit in finding this example of a Integra, that this was the insurance company's valuation.

Tom: It's like this long page of arguments, but the assessor, first thing he said on the phone was, this is a ridiculous situation.

Tom: It's listed as $salvage because the car is worth, you know, much, much more than what we valued at.

Tom: It's completely undervalued.

Tom: So I think it's fair, and I've talked to my manager about it, and he says we're happy to do this.

Tom: We'll give you the full payout, and we'll send the car back to you at no cost.

Phil: Yep.

Tom: So out of this, you have to take the, what I paid for that year's insurance, which was, I think, $and the excess, which was $

Tom: So minus $you take the payout, which was $you add that, let's just say, $for the stolen items, you've got $from the insurance company, and you've got, to get that, you've paid $

Tom: So it was a rare instance in profiting from an insurance company, which additionally was due to the insurance company's own duplicitous bullshit.

Phil: Well, congratulations.

Phil: I don't think there's anyone else who could tell that story or accomplish that.

Phil: You know, it just goes to show, if you can, how much money do they spend putting all these other barriers in front of you, talking to the person who can actually go, yeah, you're right.

Tom: Exactly.

Phil: We'll just do the right thing.

Phil: Like if they just had more people in the front of the line, you could go, yeah, this is, I'm a human being, you're a human being.

Phil: Yep, yep, you caught us.

Phil: We're being unreasonable.

Tom: And how much do you think, by the way, that the repairs cost to replace the ignition barrel?

Phil: Look, what they cost and what they charge, I'm going to say you could possibly charge $

Phil: It probably cost half that, $

Tom: Well, I had to source the ignition barrel myself.

Tom: So we've got to include the labor and the price.

Tom: $is the total you're thinking.

Tom: The ignition barrel was, I got it for $with a badge as well.

Phil: Nailed it, as I said, $

Tom: So about $for the ignition barrel itself.

Tom: And I think the labor cost, it was between $to $

Phil: So I'm close.

Phil: I said $

Tom: Well done.

Phil: I should be on some sort of game show, man, as opposed to this show.

Phil: What's this show doing for me?

Phil: All right, we got to close things up.

Phil: So I've got just a couple of fun questions for you.

Phil: Now, I've listened to some podcasts.

Phil: Listeners have asked the host questions, and I have not been satisfied with the answers that were given.

Phil: So I'm going to ask you these questions and get your immediate responses.

Phil: So we'll do two of them.

Phil: Ben writes in and says, Nintendo delayed the release of Advance Wars Reboot for Switch due to the outbreak of hostilities in Ukraine.

Phil: How do you feel about game companies responding to real world events?

Phil: Does this seem like the correct response or an overreaction?

Phil: Tom?

Tom: I think it's neither the correct response nor an overreaction.

Tom: I think if they want to do that, they may as well.

Tom: The only question would be, what is the significance of the Ukrainian War as opposed to any other war that might be occurring at any particular time?

Phil: Right, like things going on in Sudan, for example.

Phil: Like, you know, there's been massive hostilities in Sudan.

Phil: Do you think Nintendo is going to delay Advance Wars because of a war in Sudan?

Phil: Probably not.

Tom: It might inspire them, if anything.

Phil: Yeah, it might terrible these more games like Advance Wars.

Phil: Excellent.

Phil: Next question.

Phil: Brock asks, What do you think the likelihood would be of Nintendo ever porting and releasing their games on Steam?

Phil: Porting old games like Mario and NES seems like it would be money for nothing.

Tom: I think the only way that might happen would be in some sort of package, like the Sega collections.

Tom: But even though they have branched out into releasing games on mobile platforms and tablets and that sort of thing, I don't see it happening soon.

Phil: No, and I would add, even as these are questions for you, I would think Nintendo would never do that because their back catalogue, they release through their online subscription service and there's value there.

Phil: They control it.

Phil: I think there's still a little bit of fear and intrepidation about releasing Nintendo properties on a PC where it could be, even though all of their products have been defiled and put on to every other system already, rather every other system, I mean pirated, you can play any Nintendo NES game there is.

Phil: So should they be getting money because the only other option is piracy to play the games on PC?

Phil: You know, that might be something.

Phil: I went to buy a CD for my daughter, right?

Phil: And because she's getting of the age where it's like, yeah, she should start to have her own music and listen to it in a room and listen to it in a room and all the rest of it.

Phil: The only option for a physical media for this particular Australian artist was to buy it from the UK.

Phil: It was going to cost me £plus another £to deliver it, so God knows what that is in earth money.

Phil: So I was like, OK, well, I'll just go on Amazon and buy the digital download and then I'll burn it to a CD because I don't want her having access to digital.

Phil: You know, I don't want her on the internet.

Phil: I don't want her streaming, right?

Phil: I want to have a CD, put a CD player and play it.

Phil: So I go to Amazon and I'm like, OK, yeah, I'd like to give you money.

Phil: Since I couldn't give the artist money by buying a CD, I'll give you money that you can give the artist so I can buy the MPso I can put it on my own CDR that I paid for and give it to my daughter.

Phil: And they're like, no, no, you can stream it.

Phil: We'll give it to you for free because you're part of Amazon Prime, but you can't download it.

Phil: You just go stream it.

Phil: So what are my options?

Phil: I go to YouTube, then I go to YouTube to mporg.China.whatever, right?

Phil: They put in the URL so I can actually download the mpso I can burn it to a disc.

Phil: How is this helping the artist?

Phil: How is this helping the artist that the only choice that I had to get their music if I didn't want to stream it, other than, you know, paying a bajillion UK dollars for something, is to basically go and pirate it.

Phil: Anyway, I'll give you one more question.

Tom: It doesn't help the artist, but it does help the streaming platform.

Phil: Helps the streaming platform, right.

Tom: I think it's the goal there.

Phil: Okay, so here's one for you, and this will be the last question, then we'll close it out if that's okay.

Phil: John writes, this is a big question.

Phil: The last two console generations seem to have lacked the big tentpole type big releases that everyone could be hyped for.

Phil: What do you attribute this to?

Phil: That's a tough one.

Phil: The last two console generations lacked the big tentpole type big releases.

Phil: What do you attribute to this?

Phil: So why are you thinking about that?

Phil: Like for me, I go, okay, well, the Xbox launched with Halo.

Phil: That wasn't a big tentpole type release.

Phil: No one was like, oh, yeah, Halo.

Phil: Let's go get Halo.

Phil: Then I think about the GameCube.

Phil: It launched with like Wave Race and Luigi's Mansion in a Star Wars game.

Phil: Like I can't think of any console.

Phil: Well, look, Dreamcast launching with Soul Calibur is probably the biggest game that I can think of, where it was a quality game that stood the test of time.

Tom: I think if we're looking out, let's look at the best-selling PSgames, for example.

Tom: So there's Marvel's Spider-Man Ratchet & Clank Rift Apart, Alderaan, Final Fantasy XV and Demon's Souls.

Tom: What's the latest Xbox console called?

Phil: Xbox X and Xbox S series.

Phil: Or Xbox Series X, Xbox Series S.

Tom: So let's look at...

Tom: How can you even find that?

Phil: I know, it's idiocy.

Tom: I may have found one on Simply Games.

Tom: No, that's a shop.

Tom: That's their best-selling games on the shop.

Tom: I can find the Xbox One.

Phil: The biggest Xbox games are going to be like, you know, Fortnite, you know.

Phil: There haven't been any breakthrough titles on Xbox yet.

Tom: Xbox Series S best-selling games.

Phil: Yeah.

Tom: So looking at them, we've got Avatar, Forza, Elden Ring, Madden, Infinite, Sonic, Borderlands, Cyberpunk.

Tom: What I think it is, I think it's that they are, I think those.

Phil: Right.

Tom: Ratchet and Clank sold million, Elden Ring .

Tom: The difference, if there is a difference, I think, and I don't know if it really applies, but it sort of does.

Tom: If you look at this list of games, we'll just do the PSone first.

Tom: What does this all consist of?

Tom: The only sort of new or newish idea here is Elden Ring.

Tom: And in terms of, no doubt, there are differences in the gameplay, but it's still, I think, a pretty similar sort of take on the whole Souls structure of things.

Tom: Maybe Final Fantasy is sort of a bit different.

Tom: I'm not sure.

Tom: But I think if there's a difference, there is a much bigger reliance on, I think, nostalgia in the bigger selling and most popular games and things that attract people to a console than there was in the past.

Tom: I think that's not to say that other consoles, their important games early on or later, were not franchises that already existed.

Tom: For instance, Zelda and Mario games.

Tom: But I think with those sorts of games, when they were being released in a new console, the attraction of them was seeing the same thing done in a new way.

Tom: Whereas that maybe applies a bit to Elden Ring.

Tom: But I think the attraction of something like Ratchet and Clank is, even though they're not a literal, just basic remake, it's very much we want to see this in the modern world as opposed to as a new game.

Tom: It's more about seeing it in with modern graphics and modern production values, as opposed to a new sort of take on it.

Tom: I think that's perhaps the big difference.

Phil: Yeah, and I think also too with Microsoft, they don't have the big sellers because they're selling their subscription service.

Phil: Okay, well with that, I think we can close out episode of The Game Under Podcast.

Phil: Thank you for joining us.

Phil: I am Phil Fogg.

Tom: I'm Tom Towers.

Phil: And see you next time.

Phil: As usual, we have great outros.

Phil: Fantastic.

Phil: What do Australians even say goodbye?

Phil: Toodle-oo?

Phil: Ta?

Phil: What do we say?

Tom: Ta-ta.

Phil: Hooroo?

Phil: Hooroo.

Phil: I think that's one of them.

Tom: That's what we say to the kangaroos when they're hopping past.

Phil: Yeah, hooroo.

Phil: Goodbye.

Tom: Bye.